Does Scion need to exist?

"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
10/22/2014 at 16:38 • Filed to: None

Really, would anyone miss the Xb and Xa? Or the Tc? what about the iQ. Next question; is there any reason these couldn't easily just be Toyota's? Scion racked up 46,000 sales last year, down 14.6% over the previous year. For reference, Toyota sold 55,000 4runners in 2014. Just 4Runners. Do people not know that these are just Toyota's?

Why does this brand exist?

DISCUSSION (26)

G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3 > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:40

The fact that the xA was replaced by the xD in 2008 shows how little the general public cars.

HammerheadFistpunch > G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3
10/22/2014 at 16:41

holy crap you're right! man alive.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:41

Scion exists because Toyota themselves believed they had killed their name dead with dullness in this country for the young market. They successfully marketed to the young just long enough for the young to realize Scion was also dull. End of.

Lumpy44, Proprietor Of Fine Gif > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:42

I know someone who bought an Xa and returned it the second they found out what it would cost to insure it. Almost 3 times as much as his Civic.

HammerheadFistpunch > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht
10/22/2014 at 16:42

I guess its true, biege is still beige, even if you call it flint desert mica.

MIATAAAA > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:43

I think they made a mistake with the brand. It's got some good (and one great!) car(s). But the Scion name, which was supposed to be "young and hip and cool" has become "cheap and teeny bopper".

I'd rather drive a "Toyota" than a "Scion" re: image. By a long shot, too.

Cé hé sin > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:43

To answer your question, no. I live in a Scion free zone and life goes on.

HammerheadFistpunch > Lumpy44, Proprietor Of Fine Gif
10/22/2014 at 16:44

WHAT?! why?

HammerheadFistpunch > MIATAAAA
10/22/2014 at 16:46

Scion, the brand, really did become synonymous with "my first Toyota" in a bad way. I remember the 1st gen TC was pretty interesting, except that it wasn't, its just everything else in that bracket was also tedious.

Lumpy44, Proprietor Of Fine Gif > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:47

I guess a lot of people (Asian teenagers in lower Mainland of BC) wreck them quite often. Parts are also pretty rare.

Tripper > MIATAAAA
10/22/2014 at 16:47

The only good Scion is a Subaru

PS9 > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:48

Scion's problem is that it is marketed toward a segment of car buyers who have been eliminated from the new car market.

New money aren't interested in settling for a toyota and go for the Beemers and Benzs.

Old money does the same thing.

The remaining middle class and otherwise lucky young people able to take on a 5 year responsibility are spoiled for choice in the sport compact market right now, and Scion cannot compete in some key ways (no answer to the Focus ST at all? No MazdaSpeed 3 fighter?) Scion would have been a great idea at the beginning of the 90s, when its target market hadn't yet been pushed out, but now its just a bad idea.

Dusty Ventures > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 16:52

I bet the current line of Scion cars would actually sell better if badged and sold as Toyotas. The Scion brand image has been, to me at least, pretty much ruined.

HammerheadFistpunch > Dusty Ventures
10/22/2014 at 16:54

the follow up question: when was peak scion? I would say at the end of the gen 1 Xb

RazoE > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 17:16

As a scion owner, let me just say this:

Scion doesn't need to die, it just needs to get back on track. To repair Scion, one has to ask himself: "Why does it exist in the first place?" Simple. Lure younger buyers into the Toyota umbrella. Scion itself means "descendant" or a "branch from a tree." In this case Scion is a scion of Toyota. The whole entire point was to get parents to buy their kid an xA or an xB. Once the kids outgrew them, they'd graduate to a Corolla, then a Camry and then either an Avalon or jump to Lexus. That has been the plan all along. It's brilliant. It worked.

Then came time to redesign the cars (as the xB's been around since 1999, virtually unchanged in Japan.) So they asked Scion owners what they wanted. BIG MISTAKE. You don't ask what they want, you TELL THEM: "Here...buy this as is, or you feel it's too young for you...we have plenty of selection in our other brands." People wanted a bigger xb, with a bigger engine, but the problem is like a fat lady trying to wear cute clothes that are too young/small for her. It doesn't look right, and downright embarassing. Yes the xB grew, but it shouldn't have! No. Toyota should have shown them a Rav4 and said "here, THIS is what you want." That would have been fine. But noooooo they tried to keep people in Scions longer than they should have, in essence screwing the whole reason for scion in the first place!

Along came the tC and it sold like hot cakes! Why? It's a 2 door coupe with a giant glass roof. Very cool! Cheap! Then what happened? It grew, got more power (and more weight), and it tried to look hipper than it was, with it's funky pillar. NOOOOOOO!!! Toyota should have shown them a Corolla XRS and said "this is what you want now. It has 2 more doors for those kids that you had in the past 5 years."

Then we got the xD. A BIGGER FATTER XA. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Same mistake again!!!!!

The FR-S is a no-frills car. It's cheap, slow as hell, not pretty, but not ugly. It even has tons of space. JUST LIKE THE ORIGINAL XB/XA!!!! The difference? 2 less doors and RWD. That's it. That's why it's selling so well.

What happened with the iQ though? It's too expensive. If it were 13k instead of 16k, it would sell even better. It's big selling point is the fact that despite being small, there's lots of room and TONS of airbags (11, if I recall?). Parents gobble that stuff up. It also doesn't have a manual transmission. Up until the iQ EVERY SINGLE SCION HAS HAD A MANUAL OPTION. Why is that important? Kids think it's cool. It can make a slow car fun (but still slow). Kids don't need 300 hp turbo FR-S's, they need a slow one with a 3rd pedal so they think they're cool while doing 30. Isn't that prefferable?

The scion forumula that works is: Slow car with lots of space, but still small and cheap with a manual option (even if most are sold as automatics).

tldr; scion doesn't need to change/die, those people just need to get Toyotas instead.

HammerheadFistpunch > RazoE
10/22/2014 at 17:20

This reminds me of why prequel movies don't work. We know the ending, and the plot is pigeon holed from the start. If the end goal is to get kids excited about a Toyota...just make these cars Toyota.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 17:20

FRS.

HammerheadFistpunch > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies
10/22/2014 at 17:21

nope, the FRS was the hail marry, when the peak had come and gone. The sales number bare this out.

RazoE > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 17:21

Prequels is a perfect example. It ruins the magic.

TheLOUDMUSIC- Put it in H! > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 17:24

Biege is not beige. And it's Flaxen Mica, damnit.

/grammar/colornamenazi

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 17:42

It is the most critically acclaimed Scion though.

HammerheadFistpunch > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies
10/22/2014 at 17:46

scratch off "Scion" write in "Toyota" its not even remotely a scion product anyway.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 17:47

It isn't, but to the buyers it is.

ranwhenparked > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 18:57

It exists because of some market research study Toyota commissioned in the go-go '90s that convinced them they needed a new brand to give them a fresh start with the young people since the main Toyota brand had been too tarnished by appealing to the olds. Basically very similar thinking behind GM creating Saturn, only Toyota has had much worse results (Saturn sales at least broke well into the 6 figures per year for nearly all of its history).

Toyota even lumps Scion into the Toyota division's sales totals so the terrible numbers don't stand out as much on their monthly reports, even though it is very clearly a separate brand.

They ought to ditch it and just call every one of its models a Corolla - Toyota Corolla tC, Toyota Corolla xD, etc. so they can pad Corolla sales figures even more, since we all know they love doing that.

Diablo Himself > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 22:32

2006?

Sn210 > HammerheadFistpunch
10/22/2014 at 23:10

The begining of gen 1 xB